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>From: Andre Engels <csg419@wing.rug.nl>
Subject: OFF: CFJ 827 Judgement: TRUE
To: nomic-official@teleport.com
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 95 10:51:17 MET
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Status: RO

======================================================================
			ASSIGNMENT CFJ 827
Player Favor violated 1497 when he posted to the Public Forum the message 
entitled "Apothecary's Romance".
======================================================================
Judge:		elJefe
Judgement:	

Eligible:	Andre, Chuck, Coco, Dave Bowen, elJefe, favor, KoJen, 
		Michael, Morendil, SaltWater, Steve, Vanyel, Zefram

Not Eligible:	
Caller:		Oerjan
Barred:		
On Hold:	

Effects:	elJefe gains 5 Points for speedy Judgement
		favor must issue a Formal Apology

======================================================================

History:
  Called by Oerjan, 8 Nov 1995, 17:11 +0100 (MET)
  Assigned to elJefe, 8 Nov 1995, 17:50 MET
  Judged TRUE by elJefe, 9 Nov 1995, 12:47 -0500

======================================================================

Arguments: none

======================================================================

Judgement:   TRUE

Reasons:

|favor| claims the statements in the message (EXHIBIT A) were not "presented 
as correct", since the Subject line "Apothecary's Romance" should have alerted
us to the fact that the statements were not factual.

I reject this, as common sense and Game Custom require at least an initial
presumption that an unadorned statement, without preamble or explanation, 
is to be taken at face value.  Several players did so take it (though 
believing it mistaken), and if it had been something else, e.g. a Mark 
transfer, it could have taken effect regardless of the Subject line.

It would be possible to judge FALSE if |favor| merely posted the statements
with reckless disregard as to their truth or falsity. However, the judge's
Examination of the Defendant indicates that this was not the case.

Others have tried to claim that an attempted game move is not the same
as "presenting information".  I reject this also.  A statement of the
form "I hereby cause a transfer ..." certainly presents information to 
the Recordkeepors for whatever currency is involved.

Again, had this been a legal transfer, it could have taken effect. 
It would take place at the time it is "reported" (Rule 1472).  It's hard to 
see how one can "report" a transaction without "presenting information."

This is not to say that all attempted illegal moves are violations of 1497.
Only those in which the initiator emself disbelieved the information reported.


----------------------------------------
Injunction:

Tempering Justice with Mercy, I decline to issue any Injunction containing
Prescribed Words for the required Formal Apology.  The Formal Apology
is required, but the words I leave up to the ingenuity and creativity
of the Defendant.

- elJefe, Judge


======================================================================

Evidence:
> > Huh? What? Did I miss another Loophole or are you just making fun?
> 
> Apologies if I went over the top on this one!  People just
> kept saying during the Rule 101 discussions things like
> "You can say '1000 EVs are hereby transfered to me' in
> the PF if you want, but nothing happens."  I thought I'd
> give it a try, just in case...   *8)
> | favor |


======================================================================

Additional Evidence, added by Judge:


Rule 1497/0 (Mutable, MI=1)
Truth in Advertising

      No Player shall present, as correct, information which e
      believes to be incorrect in any of the following:
        -a post to the Public Forum
        -evidence in a COE, CFJ, or Judgement
        -a response to a request for information which the
         Player is required to provide.

History:
Created by Proposal 1667, Aug. 18 1995

----------------------------------------
EXHIBIT A:

Date: Wed, 8 Nov 95 09:36:09 EST
>From: "David M. Chess" <chess@watson.ibm.com>
To: nomic-business@teleport.com
Subject: BUS: Apothecary's Romance

I hereby cause 217 Extra Votes to be created and transferred
to me.  I hereby cause the right to cast up to nine votes
on any and all Proposals to be granted to me.

Gad, what a feeling of power!   *8)

| favor |


----------------------------------------
EXHIBIT B:

>From: Andre Engels <csg419@wing.rug.nl>
Subject: Re: BUS: Apothecary's Romance
To: nomic-discussion@teleport.com
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 95 15:41:30 MET

>
> I hereby cause 217 Extra Votes to be created and transferred
> to me.  I hereby cause the right to cast up to nine votes
> on any and all Proposals to be granted to me.
>
> Gad, what a feeling of power!   *8)
>
> | favor |
>

Huh? What? Did I miss another Loophole or are you just making fun?

Andre

(confused)


----------------------------------------
EXHIBIT C:
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 95 10:43:28 EST
>From: "David M. Chess" <chess@watson.ibm.com>
To: nomic-discussion@teleport.com
Subject: re: BUS: Apothecary's Romance

> Huh? What? Did I miss another Loophole or are you just making fun?

Apologies if I went over the top on this one!  People just
kept saying during the Rule 101 discussions things like
"You can say '1000 EVs are hereby transfered to me' in
the PF if you want, but nothing happens."  I thought I'd
give it a try, just in case...   *8)

| favor |

----------------------------------------
Examination of the Defendant:

Date: Wed, 8 Nov 1995 13:23:04 -0500
>From: jlc (Jeff Caruso)
To: chess@watson.ibm.com
Subject: Re: OFF: CFJ 827 Assignment: elJefe
Cc: jlc

Greetings, David!

I've been assigned as Judge in this CFJ, which alleges that you broke
Rule 1497.  I have received your argument posted subsequently in 
the Public Forum; thank you.  It is relevant to ask your state of 
mind when you posted the following message:

> Date: Wed, 8 Nov 95 09:36:09 EST
> From: "David M. Chess" <chess@watson.ibm.com>
> To: nomic-business@teleport.com
> Subject: BUS: Apothecary's Romance
> 
> I hereby cause 217 Extra Votes to be created and transferred
> to me.  I hereby cause the right to cast up to nine votes
> on any and all Proposals to be granted to me.
> 
> Gad, what a feeling of power!   *8)
> 
> | favor |

I invite you to give evidence on this matter.  Specifically, when you
posted the message, which is it most accurate to say: 

   A)  you believed that you thereby caused the actions mentioned,
 
   B)  you disbelieved this,
or
   C)  you posted the statements without believing or disbelieving this,
       that is without regard to the truth of the statements.

If I've missed a possibility please let me know.

Regards,
- elJefe, Judge

******************************************************************
  Dr. Jeffrey L. Caruso <jlc@triple-i.com>
  Information International

>From chess@watson.ibm.com Wed Nov  8 14:05:51 1995
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 95 14:05:17 EST
>From: "David M. Chess" <chess@watson.ibm.com>
To: jlc@triple-i.com
Cc: jlc@Camex.COM

Thank you, your honor, for your careful consideration of my
case!  In answer to your question, statement (B) is the most
accurate, in that if pressed I would have agreed with the view
that my posting did not cause the actions mentioned, at least
not within the context of Agora Nomic.  I hurl myself upon
the mercy of the Court...

| favor, the Accused |


----------------------------------------